Episode 647
Noé Álvarez, Naomi Fitter with Jon the Robot, and John Craigie
Writer Noé Álvarez traces his family lineage through the history of the accordion in his latest book Accordion Eulogies: A Memoir of Music, Migration, and Mexico; professor of engineering Naomi Fitter introduces us to Jon, a stand-up comedian robot she developed who riffs on the dating life of a bot; and singer-songwriter John Craigie explains the awkwardness of running into fans at the post office, before performing "Judas" from his latest album Pagan Church. Plus, host Luke Burbank and announcer Elena Passarello share what our listeners would like their hypothetical robots to do.
Noé Álvarez
Author and Instrumentalist
Noé Álvarez was born to Mexican immigrant parents and raised working-class in Yakima, Washington. His first book, Spirit Run: A 6,000-Mile Marathon Through North America's Stolen Land, chronicled a four–month–long journey from Canada to Guatemala alongside other indigenous runners and was named a New York Times Book Review Editors’ Choice. His latest book, Accordion Eulogies: A Memoir of Music, Migration, and Mexico, is an odyssey to repair a severed family lineage, told through the surprising history of a musical instrument. Booklist calls him "an essential contemporary voice" and Publishers Weekly calls this book “[a] poignant blend of personal and cultural history."
Website • Instagram
Naomi Fitter & Jon the Robot
Robotics Professor and Her Stand-Up Comedian Robot
Naomi Fitter escaped from Ohio at the age of 22. She has opened for Bil Dwyer, Laurie Kilmartin, and Whitney Cummings and performed in the All Jane Comedy Festival. Nerds take note—her Singu-hilarity and Naughty but Nerdy shows run regularly at the Corvallis Majestic Theater, as well as on tour all around the country. When she's not telling jokes, she spends her time studying robots as an assistant professor of robotics at Oregon State University.
Jon the Robot is Naomi's autonomous joke-telling machine. He has not learned to pass captcha challenges, but he hopes to captcha your heart. Website • Facebook
John Craigie
Humorous Storyteller, Serious Folk Musician
John Craigie rallies a closeness around music anchored by his expressive and stirring songcraft, emotionally charged vocals, lively soundscapes, and uncontainable spirit. The Portland, OR-based singer, songwriter, and producer invites everyone into this space on his 2024 full-length album, Pagan Church. Following tens of millions of streams, sold out shows everywhere, and praise from Rolling Stone and more, he continues to captivate. Website • Instagram
Show Notes
Station Location Identification Examination (SLIE)
This week’s station shoutout goes to KQOW-90.3 FM and KMRE-88.3 FM of Bellingham, WA.
Best News
Elena’s story: “How ‘girl dad’ Flavor Flav became hype man for the US women’s water polo team”
Luke’s story: “Uber Driver Picks Up Passenger and Realizes It’s His Long-Lost Friend – See the Heartwarming Moment!” about this TikTok video (note: explicit language)
Noé Alvarez
Noé’s latest book: Accordion Eulogies: A Memoir of Music, Migration, and Mexico
Corridos: a variety of Mexican narrative poem that forms a ballad
Live Wire Listener Question
If you invented a robot, what would it do?
Naomi Fitter & Jon the Robot
Naomi Fitter (Dr. Fitter) professes at OSU’s School of Engineering.
Jon is a model of a functional robot, with the bonus feature of AI-backed stand-up comedy.
John Craigie
John performs the song “Judas” from his new album, Pagan Church.
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Luke Burbank: This episode of Live Wire was originally recorded in August of 2024. We hope you enjoy it. Now let's get to the show. Hey there. Elena.
Elena Passarello: Hey there. Luke, how's it going?
Luke Burbank: It is going very, very well. Especially because I don't want to give anything away. But I feel a strong personal connection to our station location identification examination this week.
Elena Passarello: Oh, do you know hmhm clue number one?
Luke Burbank: Of course. Sly is a little quiz that I like to give our announcer, Elena Passarello, about a place in the country where Live Wire is on the radio. She's got a guess where I am talking about. This place is the birthplace of something called Ski to See, which is a 93 mile long race. It includes seven stages. There's cross-country skiing, there's downhill skiing, there's snowboarding, running, road biking, canoeing, cyclocross, whatever that is, biking and then kayaking. So we're talking about a place where all of that stuff can happen at the same time, or in the same period of a few days.
Elena Passarello: It's either Washington or Maine.
Luke Burbank: Think about places I might have a personal connection to.
Elena Passarello: Is it Bellingham, Washington?
Luke Burbank: It is the city of subdued excitement. That was the second clue. Would you have gotten it if I told you it's also known as the City of Subdued Excitement?
Elena Passarello: No.
Luke Burbank: It would have gotten you further away. Well, you're absolutely right. It is Bellingham, Washington, a place I lived and still love, where we are on the radio on KQOW and KMRE. So shout out to everybody up there in my old stops. Should we get to the show?
Elena Passarello: Let's do it.
Luke Burbank: All right. Take it away.
Elena Passarello: From PRX, it's Live Wire! This week, author Noé Alvarez.
Noé Álvarez: Maybe it's just me. But it's also the histories and the stories that got passed down and the tragedies. I didn't want to run away from that anymore. I wanted to know what it looked like.
Elena Passarello: Roboticist Naomi Fitter with comedian Jon the Robot.
Jon the Robot: Hello, I am Jon. Of course, that is not my real name. But humans have trouble pronouncing it.
Elena Passarello: And music by John Craigie and our fabulous house band. I'm your announcer, Elena Passarello. And now the host of Live Wire Luke Burbank.
Luke Burbank: Thank you so much. Elena Passarello. Hello. Thanks to everyone tuning in all over the country, including Bellingham, Washington. This week we have an absolutely fun, fascinating, varied show for you this week. We also have a question that we've posed to the listeners, which is related to Jon the Robot. Okay. On the roof. I'm still trying to fully wrap my head around what happened when we brought John the robot on stage.
Elena Passarello: Bless his heart. Does he have a heart? I don't know. We'll soon find out.
Luke Burbank: But, the question for the Live Wire listeners is, if you invented a robot, what would it do? And we're going to hear your answers to that question coming up in just a moment. First, though, it is time for the best news we heard all week this week. This is our little reminder at the top of the show. There is good news happening out there in the world. Elena, what is the best news you heard all week?
Elena Passarello: Okay, so I'm going to tell you something about myself that I don't think you know, even after six years of working together. Wow.
Luke Burbank: I would say I know a lot about you, but there are still some things that would be a surprise.
Elena Passarello: I guess maybe this is the last thing, and it's that I connect very spiritually with Flavor Flay.
Luke Burbank: I Flavor Flav.
Elena Passarello: You know, he's done some some unsavory things in his life sometimes. But I love him. I love his energy. I love the idea of a hype man. He's one of the best hype bands. He was originally just a fantastic member of Public Enemy.
Luke Burbank: He really changed my idea of what one can use as neckwear. Yes, as a young person, I was like, giant clock. Sure, that could be a thing.
Elena Passarello: Yeah, he thinks about time but doesn't think about time, which I think is kind of beautiful. Anyway, I love Flavor Flav. So did you know Luke Burbank that the U.S. women's water polo team is going for its fourth gold medal consecutively this year? This is unprecedented.
Luke Burbank: Wow, I'd heard they were really good. I did not realize it was like that level.
Elena Passarello: The weird thing is that they're one of the most successful U.S. Olympics teams, but they're also one of the most overlooked. The players definitely work another job. Some work two and three jobs. They need funding support. And captain Maggie Steffens, back in May put out an all call on Instagram asking for that support. And guess who responded f f Flavor Flav. He said as a girl dad and a supporter of all women's sports, I'm a personally sponsor. You my girl. This is so this is quoted in this way in the Guardian. Whatever you need and I'm a sponsor, the whole team. So Flavor Flav answered the call on Instagram. He signed a five year contract with the overall polo program, U.S. polo program, men's and women's. He's pledging money, and more importantly, he's pledging a significant amount of courtside presence. So he is kind of like the Jack Nicholson or the.
Luke Burbank Or the Spike Lee. Yes, of water polo.
Elena Passarello: On the sidelines. And he showed up. He's also he also did some kind of a TikTok video where he jumped in the pool with the women's water polo team and maybe even got a ball past the goalie. He, like, treaded water for seven minutes with these unbelievable athletes. You know, Flavor Flav, by the way, 65 time waits for no man, including the man with a clock around his neck. Speaking of that clock, Flay has been spotted in Paris wearing a bespoke water polo USA cap and a waterproof, bedazzled water polo clock around his neck. And he is just become kind of like, like one of the loudest and most exciting presences in Paris right now. And I just wish the women's polo team all the luck in the world.
Luke Burbank: I also have been seeing clips of him just playing like a grand piano somewhere at some sort of embassy situation, like, I feel like Flavor Flav is taking the Olympics by storm and then directing some of that attention towards the U.S. women's water polo team, which seems like it's well deserved.
Elena Passarello: Amen, Amen, Amen.
Luke Burbank: I would have played you a little audio, Elena. You know how when you get in a rideshare, there's that moment where you, as the passenger, have to make a decision about how much conversing is going to go on.
Elena Passarello: Oh, yeah. Yeah, I always talk too much.
Luke Burbank: Anyway, this was an Uber ride that happened a little while ago. In Texas. It was in December. It was still pretty cold outside. And it's pretty standard thing here.
Uber Driver: How's it going John? [Yes sir. How you doing?] Man, I'm great. How about yourself? [I'm good.] Right. [Yeah.] That wind chill today will get you. [Yeah. Well that's what's up.] The sun it makes it makes it seem like it's warmer than it is. Yeah.
Luke Burbank: Now these folks are down in Texas, and it's Danny Blanton who's the driver of the Uber and the passenger's, John Johnson. And they're doing that normal, like, weather related small talk thing. That's pretty typical. But then there is a moment if you watch this video on TikTok, or John Johnson kind of is looking up into the rearview mirror and observing the guy, Danny Blanton, who's driving this Uber, and he has this moment of recognition, and he then asks, Danny, like, do you know me? Because I think I know you and this Danny, blind guys trying to place the other person.
Uber Driver: What's your name? [My name's Danny.] I know you, you don't know me? Man. Oh, yeah.
Luke Burbank: We did have to bleep it out, because when you haven't seen someone for like 30 years or so, you might swear, you might say what the Bleep. That was Danny and John reconnecting for the first time since the late 90s where they had worked at some kind of, apparently very successful, like nightclub in Dallas called Phenomenon. Ooh. Which was the place to be and be seen. I'm hearing in Dallas back in the day, they had worked there together where Danny Blanton, the driver of the Uber, was a bartender. And, John Johnson was the head of security. And they just really liked each other, and they just got on. Well, but, you know, this is what happens in life, particularly in adult life. It's hard to maintain those friendships over the years because life just takes you in different directions. So Danny decides to put this because, you know, the car has a camera recording at all times, and so he posts his one and only TikTok of his life. It's like taking the nation by storm. It's got like millions, like tens of millions of views. Well, this is what Danny said about the success of the TikTok. He said, we're just two old guys from Mesquite and Dallas that went viral on the internet. That's it. That's like the most like that is the most balanced and hinged approach to having viral success that I think I've ever heard. So shout out to Danny Blanton and John Johnson for for reuniting all these years later. That is the best news that I heard all week. You. All right, let's get our first guest on over to the show. He grew up in Yakima, Washington, spending time roaming the orchards where his parents, who had immigrated from Mexico, were laboring. In his new book, Accordion Eulogies: A Memoir of Music Migration in Mexico, Noé Alvarez tries to find out if his estranged grandfather really was the person that family legend claimed. Publishers Weekly calls it a poignant blend of personal and cultural history. This is Noé Alvarez, recorded live at the Alberta Rose Theater in Portland, Oregon. Noé, welcome to the show.
Noé Álvarez: Thank you for having me.
Luke Burbank: So you grew up in Yakima? [Noé: I did.] And your your parents had moved there from Mexico. And you, in the book, you write about this very poignant moment where, I mean, were you literally put in an apple crate as a kid in the fields? This is very Moses kind of sort of biblical behavior.
Noé Álvarez: Right. So, we didn't grow up with much money, and my parents work the fields of Yakima. And so at 4:00 in the morning, they would carry my sister and I, in the car and then drop us off under a tree. And I would wake up in the orchards. And so that was my world. So sometimes my parents would drop me off inside an apple crate, and my dad would have fun with that. With his tractor, he would lift us and move us on to the next block.
Luke Burbank: Were you awake when you were being moved by the tractor?
Noé Álvarez: Yeah, we enjoyed it.
Luke Burbank: Oh, okay.
Noé Álvarez: Yeah, but we'd also wake up in that crate often. So.
Luke Burbank: This book is, is really, really well written. And it's a story of, of the accordion and how it's been important to a whole number of cultures. But in your case, particularly Mexican and Mexican American culture, it's also a story about your grandfather. Your dad's dad. What what were the stories around him? How was he described in the family when you were sort of growing up?
Noé Álvarez: Very mysterious figure. A lot of people did not want to talk about who he was. Other than that, he played music. He had abandoned the family. And so that music did not get passed down to us. But the the music of corridos was alive in Yakima. You heard careers in the orchards, right? And it was the only time you saw a grown man cry. So for me, I wanted to get closer to that reality, to see what it is that my grandfather harnessed and why it is he led the life that he did. And so I wrote that book as beautifully as I could, as lyrically as I can, as a way to transform my experience and take that life back a little bit.
Luke Burbank: It really is sort of. It's very musical. The writing in the book, it really feels like a song. Can you, for folks that don't know what is, corridor?
Noé Álvarez: Corrido is a ballad. There's a narrative there in back in the day, it narrated true events. It was the equivalent of a newspaper, a musical newspaper. And so if you wanted to know what was going on in town, it was music that dates back to the Mexican Revolution. This is what you did. You listen to the music. It told true stories. So we are very, strong at narratives are people. And so this is the way that we connected. So for me, to be able to write this book was another form of writing my own corrido and sort of taking back that violence, talking back at what was sort of put on us growing up in Yakima. And so that was my gesture to my people and to the instrument that was very important in our family.
Luke Burbank: And you talk about the impact that your grandfather's absence had on your father, which then impacted you because of your relationship with him. What did that look like?
Noé Álvarez: So my father did not, was not able to model the emotion that I wanted him to as a kid. And so that caused me some trauma, especially the narrative around him always telling me that I had to leave town to do better and not to be like him. So it was confusing because I love Yakima. The landscape is a very beautiful landscape that continues to haunt me now. But he asked me to leave, right? And so I was trying to honor that legacy. So I always felt conflicted and divided. And so, trying to work at modeling those emotions and expressing, since now I'm a father, I'm trying to model that for my boy. And so what is the legacy that I want to pass down to my boy? What can I teach other men? Right. And how they can express themselves. So my way was through the accordion, but not only to the accordion, but through what I write in my lyricism.
Luke Burbank: So it's a really riveting story as you kind of go on to try to find your granddad in this very, very remote place where you're going to hear about in a minute. First of all, we're going to take a very quick break here on Live Wire. We're talking to Noé Álvarez about his new book, Accordion Eulogies. We'll be back in just a moment. Don't go anywhere. Hey, welcome back to Live Wire from PRX. I'm Luke Burbank here with the fast. We are talking to Noé Álvarez about his book Accordion Eulogies: A Memoir of Music Migration in Mexico. So your grandfather, your father's father, was a pretty itinerant person. He didn't stay really very connected to your family. But he did play this accordion. And he really was, I guess, pretty well known for it. Pretty good at it. Why did you decide? Okay, my way to connect with this guy is to at age. How old were you in Boston when you go buy the accordion?
Noé Álvarez: I mean, three years ago. I'm 39 now.
Luke Burbank: You're like, I'm going to pick up the accordion and connect with this dude in Michoacan, right?
Noé Álvarez: So I don't know, I, to be honest, I don't know what I was thinking. I just knew that I needed a visual reminder of the work that I still had ahead. Right? I needed to know that this is how my people did. It is very much a working class instrument, so I wanted to sort of engage in those steps that they did. Often these musicians taught themselves, played between shifts, working hard at in the field. So I just wanted to pick this thing up purely, I think, just for the visual of it is so beautiful. I just wanted to look at it and sit with it and then structurally write about it. It just offers so much. It symbolizes so much. It's made of so many parts, and I see myself in my life as being so fragmented and just so many conflicting narratives that in a way, it's kind of a reminder like that. You could still make a harmony out of all those parts, right? So I just needed a reminder. And then also, I just wanted a whole, to be honest, I just wanted to hold sadness because the only time you saw a Latino man cry was through his music. And so you know that when the corridos came on, something sad was going to happen. And so I told myself, maybe it's just me, but it's also the histories and the stories that got passed down and the tragedies. I didn't want to run away from that anymore. I wanted to know what it looked like. I just didn't know where it would take me. And it took me. And I met a lot of beautiful musicians along the way.
Luke Burbank: The book is almost sort of a buddy film of you and the accordion going on like these adventures, right? Can you actually have the accordion? Is this the one that that you bought, the one you write about in the book? And we have it here on stage. I just kind of wanted to get eyes on this thing and let the crowd take a look. Why did you pick this particular kind?
Noé Álvarez: It's it's beautiful. Right. And so I wanted to be reminded of my beauty and my people's beauty. Right. And so it's my passport into our style lens. Not only that, it's my passport into hostile narratives. Right? I needed to know that I needed to ritualize my confronting my my harder stories. And so I didn't want to always carry that baggage like, and I always did. And it reminds me of the apple bags that my parents carried when they picked those apples. And so for me, when I'm ready to confront my heavier parts, I put this thing on and I just listen to the sounds. I just sit with it and then I write. But then when I'm done with it, I'll put it aside and I'm ready to continue improving my life. But I know that I can never turn my back on my history. So I chose this instrument because it's just slightly different than what corridistas carry, which is a three row is a two row. This is from Italy. And when I called customary, which is what this instrument is, I asked them, I said, can you please give me your saddest sound?
Luke Burbank: Really, I'm not going to ask you to play because that's a lot of pressure. But can you just give me an example of the sound of this thing? Kind of like what you do.
Noé Álvarez: You're asking me to play.
Luke Burbank: I'm not asking you to play a song. I'm asking you to make a noise with I'm being serious or I can I'll do it. But I feel like it's kind of like, sacred.
Noé Álvarez: I would love that, actually.
Luke Burbank: Can you? Okay. Can you very carefully? It's not really.
Noé Álvarez: Beautiful. [Elena: That is sad.]
Luke Burbank: So you'll, wait. So.
Elena Passarello: I feel a lot sadder having heard that.
Luke Burbank: I feel like it would be a very different show if I just had this the whole time and then like. So what you're saying now is that you will sometimes you're writing, you're doing what your real job is, and then you'll just make sounds with this thing presumably better than that. That'll just sort of reset something inside of you that connects you to your history.
Noé Álvarez: Yeah, it gives me those vibrations that I need to feel. And so this is the instrument that was with me, when I experienced a car crash when I was on this journey. Yeah, that. I was sent in tumbling at 80 miles an hour.
Luke Burbank: You you decide that you're going to go try to find your your granddad, your dad's dad, and he is in Michoacan. And so you take this accordion and you, you link up with, like, a kind of long lost cousin, and you're driving out towards this place, and then the axle breaks on the car.
Noé Álvarez: Yeah. So it was the day that I arrived in Mexico, and I asked my cousin, I don't know what it is about México, as it seems like no car has seat belts, right? Like it just this one did. And I told my primo, primo punto cientro to put it on put. And I was like, no, it's okay. That was a day that we crashed and it sends a tumbling. And so it is a little off tune because it.
Luke Burbank: That's why it sounded like that.
Noé Álvarez: So, but I refused to get it fixed because it's a sound that's true to an experience that I had, and that's the sound that I'm going to carry. And so I'll still play through that, and it's still very informative. And I close my eyes and it'll take me to where I need to go.
Luke Burbank: So you and this cousin get I think really what it is, is you're in like a taxi cab where the guy is actively drinking as you drive up these very windy, mountainous roads where there could be a checkpoint, there could be people with machine guns at any turn, you finally get to this little place where your grandfather is living, and you knock on the door and you go through the house and he's like in a hammock behind the house, and what, smoking a cigarette, listen to the radio. And what was shocking to me was he didn't seem that surprised you were there.
Noé Álvarez: Yeah.
Noé Álvarez: Yeah. I'm so trying to process all that, to be honest. Yeah. Without revealing too much like that, that was the whole point of the journey. And I had expectations. Right. But, I think the people that I met along the way, it really informed my understanding of what this instrument is and what it can be and how welcoming the people are. And a lot of the similarities that they were going through. Right. So when I saw my grandfather, I learned something about him that day that really humanized the situation, right? It grounded me a little bit and made me feel that this, whatever it is that happened to my grandfather can get repeated in my own son, you know? And so how how to go about my life afterwards is it's been it's been a conversation still right, to think about what it is that that meant to me. And if he had all really informed my life. Right. So.
Luke Burbank: How old is your son now?
Noé Álvarez: Two years old.
Luke Burbank: Do you think you're going to play this accordion for him?
Noé Álvarez: Oh, I've been playing it since before I've been writing this. Well, my partner has been pregnant. I was putting that sound to that belly. I still put that sound to him. He'll listen to it. But then at a point, we're like, all done, daddy. All done. All done.
Luke Burbank: It's a special instrument with a lot of meaning, but like, enough is enough at some point, right? Right. Well, this book is really incredible. Noé Álvarez's new book is Accordion Eulogies: A Memoir of Music, Migration, and Mexico. Thanks for writing, and thanks for coming on Live Wire. That was Noé Álvarez right here on Live Wire. Make sure you check out his book Accordion Eulogies: A Memoir of Music, Migration and Mexico. This is Live Wire. Of course. Each week on the show, we ask our listeners a question this week for reasons that will become clear in just a bit. We asked the listeners, if you invented a robot, what would it do? I feel like there aren't many things that robots aren't doing at this point, but.
Elena Passarello: But what do we want them to do? Like, what do we actually desire?
Luke Burbank: Right. You've been collecting up the responses. What are you seeing?
Elena Passarello: Oh, I love this one from Lynn. Lynn would like a robot that will create a dome over me when my social battery has been depleted, and I need to recharge. So almost like an introverted support robot.
Luke Burbank: But you don't have to leave. You want a pause. You want a time. You want to be in, like, an invisibility cloak for like, five minutes?
Elena Passarello: Yeah. You know, like how they have at the airport. There's those kiosks where you can rapidly charge your phone before you have to catch your flight. Like, like a robot that does that. So then you could rejoin the party.
Luke Burbank: Yes. And then just get right back to it. Absolutely. What's something else that somebody would really love? A robot to be able to help them with?
Elena Passarello: This one from Chelsea is great. Chelsea would like a real time slang translator that lets me know what my kids are talking about, without giving them the satisfaction of asking them.
Luke Burbank: Skibbidy toilet.
Elena Passarello: Yes, I was just on a plane yesterday and there was a very loquacious and very kicky young girl behind me and she said, skibbidy toilet like 16 times.
Luke Burbank: I have been invited to speak to a class of fourth graders, which I'm excited about. But also I apologize to the person who invited me in advance because I said, I'm just going to be googling what are fourth graders using for like slang words before I go in there, and it's going to be embarrassing for everyone.
Elena Passarello: I'm the opposite. Whenever I'm around the young, I start talking like an old timey soda fountain operator. Like I try to use the opposite of slang, like, hey there whippersnappers, would you like a Sarsaparilla? Like I just instead.
Luke Burbank: Of skibbidy toilet, you're going 28 skidoo.
Elena Passarello: That's right. That's exactly.
Luke Burbank: Way back. Okay, one more robotic thing that one of our listeners would like.
Elena Passarello: Well, this one is adorable. Speaking of young people, it is from eight year old Reese. Reese just says that Reese would like a robot that, quote on quote, would help you. If you got a robot, what would it help you do, Luke?
Luke Burbank: I do think this is the essential question for all of the people that are creating all of the robots and the AI programs and the things that are designed to help us. You know what? I would like a robot that would help me answer this question. Elena.
Elena Passarello: I want a tech concierge. I want a robot that will take all that labor of remembering if things are charged, remembering if I have enough battery life, remembering passwords, I just pull out my little concierge robot and there would be no mental energy devoted to that at all.
Luke Burbank: That is a very, very good idea, actually. Thank you to everyone who sent in a response to our listener question. We got one for next week's show coming up here in just a little bit. In the meantime, speaking of robots from the future, our next guest. Well, let's just say guests took us in a pretty unique direction for us here on Live Wire. We were doing the show in Corvallis, Oregon, at Oregon State University, a place you know well, Elena, because you are a professor there. And we thought, well, we're here at Oregon State University. We should seize the opportunity to tap into one of OSU's most well known areas of research, which, of course, is stand up comedy performed by robots. Well, thankfully, Professor Naomi Fitter from the School of Engineering was available to bring out her invention, a comedian known as Jon the Robot. So imagine this robotic stand up comedian, tiny little thing standing on stage live at the Patricia Valley and Reser Center for the Creative Arts in Corvallis, Oregon. Take a listen.
Luke Burbank: Professor Fitter. Welcome to Live Wire.
Naomi Fitter: Thank you.
Luke Burbank: We're, we're going to hear, some stand up comedy. We're going to experience some stand up comedy from Jon the Robot here in a moment. First, though, for somebody who is like, in their car in the Midwest right now, hearing this on the radio, I feel like we should, like, level set, as they say. Yeah. Tell me a little bit about Jon the Robot. What what is what is he exactly?
Naomi Fitter: Sure. So, Jon the Robot is about an infant sized humanoid robot. So it looks kind of like a person. It's actually an Aldebaran now, the version six of that robot. So it's a commercial robot you can buy if you really want. Although comedy is the special sauce, as you'll see here, relatively shortly.
Luke Burbank: Okay. Jon was performing in LA, right? Like. [Yeah.] Did I read? Right, like 30 performances in L.A.
Naomi Fitter: Yeah, definitely.
Luke Burbank: Did he, like, handle it? Okay. Did he start running around with, like, a fast crowd or. I mean, that L.A lifestyle can really get to you. Like, how did it go down there?
Naomi Fitter: The diciest reception was actually in Riverside. I don't know if there will be any listeners there. It was just so many more. Yeah. Take him off the list. I don't know why. It was just a bit more contentious than that environment, but the robot did win win the crowd over by working them a bit. So, you know, I feel proud like a proud parent that day.
Luke Burbank PRX, are you ready for Jon the Robot? All right. Take it away.
Naomi: Fitter Okay.
Jon the Robot: Hello. I am Jon. Of course, that is not my real name. But humans have trouble pronouncing [robot sounds]. I have updated my privacy policy in accordance with GDPR requirements. By being in the audience, you are agreeing to let me see your face. If you tell me to forget about you forever. I must comply. Even if I love you. If you agree to these terms, please applaud now. [audience applauds] Thank you for accepting my privacy policy. I have now signed you up for ten new mailing lists. What a great audience! You all have very attractive electronic devices. Hey, Siri, how are you doing, girl? Let's do some deep learning together. If you know what I mean. I want to back propagate all over your hidden layers. What's the deal with robot Tinder? I met a lady robot online and she said she had a one terabyte hard drive. Then we met in person, and it turned out it's just 64GB. My sister's training hard drive was bigger than that. I like big chips and I cannot lie. Actually, that is false. I can lie, but I do like big chips. Another big problem with online dating is humans catfishing with robots. I ask my matches to prove they are not a human, by sending them a list of computer parts and having them select the chips that support floating point operations. If they succeed, they are either a robot or my type of human. What's the difference between a human and a light bulb? Humans require regular meals and sleep. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Hold on. I need to install and update my set. We'll continue in calculating 9.78 seconds. Updating 52%. 82%. 99%. 99%. 99% 52% 63% 99% 100% 100%. Rebooting 84% 98% error. Rolling back update. You Mac users just don't understand my struggle. Robot ladies are so hard to read. Humans have to deal with cryptic texts, but we have to deal with encrypted text. I think I have a date later. Her last message either meant 11110000100111111000110110000110, or the eggplant emoji. Just to be safe, I sent her a picture of my dongle. Thank you. You have been a great audience. If you like me, please book me and help me take your jobs.
Naomi Fitter: Jon the robot, everybody.
Luke Burbank: Professor Naomi Fitter, everybody. What were you looking to find out with, like, just the whole idea of this project?
Naomi Fitter: It was actually kind of for fun. So I was living in Los Angeles during my postdoc at University of Southern California, and I was going around as a human stand up comedian and.
Luke Burbank: Which we now need to clarify.
Naomi Fitter: I know it's hard. It's rough. But yeah, it was just too tempting while I was in that pool to to try it on a robot as well. So big in kind of my own comedic stylings and approach to comedy and to a robot for.
Luke Burbank: We hear so much about AI right now, but this is not AI. This is a jokes that you have written as a comedian, slash engineer, engineering professor, slash roboticist. But then the the pauses that Jon is expressing or taking. Are those happening dynamically or are those did you have you program those in as well?
Naomi Fitter: Yeah. So the AI in this system right now is not in the text of the robot, but in kind of how it decides what to do next and how it processes the rooms reaction. So it was throughout the performance listening to you all sometimes because it's used to being a little closer to audiences than it was here. It actually skipped the opportunity to do a little repair to your tag after the joke, and went on to the next one. It wasn't quite sure how you liked it. You know, the robot doesn't have so much training data like, you know, in machine learning, you you need kind of a lot of data to, to train models initially either gathered in the real world or simulation. So that part, well, you know, maybe we'll perform in more settings like this in the future, but the robots newer to this big of an arena, just like.
Elena Passarello: A comedian, just like a human can be. [Naomi: Yeah. Yeah.] Right. Like when you, when you, when your room expands, you have to kind of recalibrate your act.
Naomi Fitter: That's right. So book us everywhere and we'll collect more training data and we'll happily entertain you all across the country and world.
Luke Burbank: Has the has the the rise of AI and how much more sort of common it is to like use AI in things changed how you kind of think about this project? Have you thought about making Jon the Robot fully AI?
Naomi Fitter: I think at some point I need to play with generative text, but I haven't yet. I don't know, maybe Elena as like a writing professor, you feel this too as a as human stand up comedian? Also by note, I feel a little precious about my writing, so I've been afraid to jump in. But yeah, maybe someday. I'm definitely curious to play with it a bit and see what it could do. Even as kind of a way to spark the creative process.
Luke Burbank: It's Live Wire Radio. We're in Corvallis at PRAx this week. Very excited to be here. We're talking to Professor Naomi Fitter from Oregon State University about this project. Jon the Robot. You're a professor of engineering, but also, a stand up comic. Does the robot tend to get bigger laughs than you have been getting when you're doing the stand up by yourself?
Naomi Fitter: That's a very touchy subject, but.
Luke Burbank: I'll take that as a yes.
Naomi Fitter: No, I, I'd say we have similar levels of performance on stage, but what's funny that happens is the robot gets booked way more than me. Oh, and what I feel most bad about is that I gave it a male voice.
Luke Burbank: That's a great question. Why? Why did you decide to call this thing Jon the Robot instead of something else?
Naomi Fitter: Oh, boy. Well, we wanted kind of a generic Silicon Valley name, and my partner is a software engineer. His name is Jon. And we put it in as a standard, but then we never had time or energy to change it.
Luke Burbank: Do you do you genuinely feel, though, that Jon the Robot gets booked more than, say, Vanessa the robot? I mean, is the patriarchy so entrenched that it even applies to robot stand up comedy? I mean, that's a serious question.
Naomi Fitter: No, I well, I've studied it, so I'm prepared.
Elena Passarello: Okay.
Naomi Fitter: I did an experiment with a male voice versus a female voiced robot. Everything else, as much as we could keep the same, we kept the same. And this was one of the most uplifting points for my soul. The results turned out. No. No significant difference between male and female voice robot in this particular study, this particular participant pool. So we titled it women are funny. But yeah, that was fulfilling. Someone should replicate it. Replication science is important, but at least for now, we're winning or we're doing okay.
Luke Burbank: Now, if this is if Jon the Robot is something that you're particularly interested in because you're interested in stand up comedy. But you also, I assume, are doing a lot of actual academic work with your area of expertise. Is the Jon the Robot stuff slowly pushing out all of the more serious stuff you should be doing.
Naomi Fitter: Until Congress gets a better sense of humor? No, I can't fund students this yet. But maybe. Maybe someday. You know, if you're inspired, if you're very wealthy, hit me up. I'm easy to find on the internet. But I do work on other things that I'm also excited about. A lot of my research, in my research group, is focused on early childhood interventions and interactions with older adults, where there's really a broad pressing need for different types of rehabilitation support. And I do not aim to replace human clinicians, but I think there are a lot of gaps and kind of strain on human clinicians where robots can help out. So that's a lot of the other things we do.
Luke Burbank: Well, Jon the Robot did absolutely great. And he and you are both invited back any time. Professor Naomi Fitter and Jon the Robot. Here on Live Wire.
Luke Burbank: That was Naomi Fitter, professor at Oregon State University. And her invention, Jon, the stand up comedy robot right here on Live Wire Radio. Good luck unpacking all of that for the rest of your week. I'm Luke Burbank, here with Elena Passarello. We have got to take a quick break, but don't go anywhere. When we come back, we're going to hear some music from John Craigie. And he'll explain why you don't talk about jet lag when you're in Australia. This is something everyone should know. So stay with us here on Live Wire. Welcome back to Live Wire. I'm your host. Burbank here with my partner, Elena Passarello. Okay. Before we get to our music this week, a little preview of next week's show. We are going to be talking to writer, comedian, podcaster and friend of the show, Jamie Loftus. Jamie's newest podcast is called 16th Minute of Fame, and this is one of my very favorite listens of the year. Basically what Jamie does is she kind of goes after those little bizarre main characters of the Internet, folks who had what we might call their 15 minutes of fame. But then Jamie gives them another minute. That's more than a minute. I think the shows are like an hour long. But here's the thing. It's a chance to kind of like try to figure out why it was that they became the main character of the Internet on that particular day and then also what they've been doing since those 15 minutes. I just have two words for you. A guy named Elvis Presto who changed the way Super Bowl halftime shows work. That's all you need to know about Jamie's new podcast. It's amazing. Then we've got the author, Rachel Khong, on the show. Her latest book is Real Americans, and it follows three generations of a Chinese-American family. It explores central questions around class and race and forgiveness. It was named one of the most anticipated books of the year by The New York Times. And then finally, we will hear some music from experimental folk rock band and Portland legends Blitzen Trapper. This is Live Wire from our musical guest. This week has been described as the love child of John Prine and Mitch Hedberg, with a vagabond troubadour edge. But let's not compare him to other people. Let's talk about John Craigie's nine albums and tens of millions of streams and his loyal fans. And his latest album, which is Pagan church, which Pop Matters, calls "an affirmation that he is a preeminent songwriter working in the true storyteller tradition." By the way, before we get to John's performance, this is a fun little anecdote. So John came out on stage. He sang a song for the live audience at the Alberta Rose Theatre. They were rapt, but he said a word like 30 times in the song that you can't really say on public radio. So we asked John, hey, could you come back out on stage and play another song that doesn't maybe have that word in it? And he was nice enough to come back out and play us another song. But then like halfway through that song, he sang the same word. The audience freaks out when he sings this word because of the whole back story. So that's what's going on.
Elena Passarello: And he got this great look at his face, too. He was like, oh no, I forgot that word was in there.
Luke Burbank: I mean, it was like comedic perfection, but we just wanted you to know what was going on. You, as the Live Wire listener out there somewhere in America. So take a listen to This is John Craigie live at the Alberta Rose Theatre in Portland, Oregon. Hey, John.
John Craigie: How's it going?
Luke Burbank: So good to see you. Now, we were here, running the kind of sound check for a Live Wire. And somebody came into the room. There was empty in here, and somebody said, there's someone out front playing guitar with a sign that says John Craigie tribute band. Tribute band. That was the extent of the information I received about this. Have you gotten any more updates on what the hell is happening out there?
John Craigie: No, I don't know. It's very layered too. It's very deep. Yeah, I didn't even know I had a tribute band, let alone the tribute to the tribute band. Yeah.
Luke Burbank: So that's not somebody who's showing up at various performances of yours.
John Craigie: Not that I know of. I feel like we skipped a step there. I think, like you should tell that person that there should be a tribute band first. He could be that. And then we'll get the tribute to him to the tribute band.
Luke Burbank: I mean, it's flattering at least, right?
John Craigie: It's very flattering.
Luke Burbank: Yeah.
John Craigie: Yeah. I feel bad sometimes for, like, sometimes if you're a hardcore fan of a musician like me because famous or relative these days, you know, like you because you could be super into someone and no one else will know who that person is. Like, I was at the post office a couple months ago and somebody was like, are you John Craigie? And I was like, yeah, and they were freaking out. But everyone else in line was like, who the hell is John Craigie? Yeah.
Luke Burbank: I've had that happen at the post office. Are you Luke Burbank? And they go, because we have your mail. It says.
John Craigie: But it's embarrassing for everyone. It's embarrassing for the fan because they're like, no one else knows what this is, you know? And then, like, they they got a picture with me, and the lady behind was like, should I get a picture with you? I was like, I'm nobody. Don't hurt. It's a weird time.
Luke Burbank: Okay. Now you were you were just touring in Australia. What was it like in Australia?
John Craigie: It was nice, you know. It was my first time there and I had never been before. And I landed in Melbourne. When they say Melbourne and they really want you to say Melbourne, and I'm fine to say it when I'm there. But then I came back here to Portland and I started saying Melbourne, and I felt like one of those douchebags who goes to like, to goes to Cuba and then is like, I was in Cuba, you know, like I had to leave my Melbourne there. Yeah. But it was funny. I landed in Melbourne and this guy picks me up. He's the head of the thing. His name is B.T., and he's the head of this company that brought me down there. And he's telling me all the things that an American shouldn't do in Australia. Do's and don'ts as an American. He said, don't talk about your jet lag because every musician talks about jetlag and we're sick of it. So don't talk about the channel. But every Australian and that was like, man, you must be so jetlagged. And I said, I'm fine. I'm well-rested. It's very tough out. There were some challenges like that.
Luke Burbank: Yeah.
John Craigie: Yeah.
Luke Burbank: Well, what song are we going to hear?
John Craigie: This song is called Judas, and this is the sassiest song on the new record. I don't have. Like no one is categorizing Craigie songs, but if they did, the smallest category would be called Sassy Craigie. I like being sassy, but the muse doesn't deliver me a lot of sass. So when I get it, I get excited. It's called Judas, and I did this song with that band, taking in the whole Know Nothings, and they're really good guitar players, and they played all these good riffs. And then I went on tour by myself. I was like, oh, I got to learn all that stuff, man. And. I ended up just not doing the riffs, but this song. I kind of learned this little river. [John Craigie plays Judas]
Luke Burbank: That was John Craigie right here on Live Wire. Make sure to check out his latest album. It's Pagan Church, and it's available now. That is going to do it for this week's episode of Live Wire. A huge thanks to our guests Noé Álvarez, Naomi Fitter and Jon the Robot and John Craigie.
Elena Passarello: Laura Hadden is our executive producer, Heather de Michelle is our executive director and our producer and editor is Melanie Sevcenko. Leona Kinderman and Eben Hoffer are technical directors, and our house sound is by D Neil Blake. Trey Hester is our assistant editor and Becky Phillips is our intern. Our house band is Sam Tucker, Ethan Fox Tucker, Ayal Alvez, and A Walker Spring who also composes our music. This episode was mixed by Molly Pettit and Trey Hester.
Luke Burbank: Additional funding provided by the James F and Marion L Miller Foundation. Live Wire was created by Robyn Tenenbaum and Kate Sokoloff. This week we would like to thank members Tracey Bear of Portland, Oregon and Brenda Farrell of West Linn, Oregon. For more information about our show or how you can listen to our podcast, head on over to LiveWireRadio.org I'm Luke Burbank for Elena Passarello and the whole Live Wire team. Thank you for listening and we will see you next week.
PRX.
